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Practically Ranching
Join Matt Perrier as he visits weekly with interesting, thoughtful, entertaining individuals within the beef community. Conversations will inspire curiosity and creativity while maintaining the independent spirit and practical nature for which ranchers are known.
Practically Ranching
#30 - Callahan Grund, We Are the Industry
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Callahan Grund is the Executive Director of US Cattle Trace, a private, not-for-profit corporation made up of representatives from all beef industry segments with the mission of securely maintaining and managing data collected for disease traceability.
We talk the recent history of cattle identification, technologies used and applicable uses for ID in the U.S. beef industry.
www.uscattletrace.org
Other podcasts mentioned during the episode:
https://theangusconversation.buzzsprout.com/2029894/11702471
https://ksubci.org/?powerpress_pinw=5438-podcast
Well, welcome to season two of practically ranching. As many of you noticed, we took a few weeks off from the podcast to focus a little bit on. Some of our main priorities with Dale banks, Angus, and the Perrier family, but it is great to be back in the saddle for our first episode of, uh, 2023 and season two. This week we kick it off with, I think just a great guest Callaghan. Grund. As is just a super young leader in the beef industry. he was raised in a, on a seed stock outfit in Western Kansas with his family. And he's, currently the executive director of cattle trace us cattle trace. He lives with his wife, Emily east of Manhattan, Kansas, and Callaghan is just a great fit this podcast. he's a student of the industry. He's always searching for improvements to our industry and to just life in general. But he has a straightforward, practical way of going about this and implementing these changes. So, we're going to title this, even though we talk mainly about us cattle trace and animal ID and things like this, we're going to title this episode, "We are the industry," and, you'll hear why we call it this later in the podcast, but, uh, I think it's an appropriate title for this discussion and for Callahan himself and, just. Everybody probably listening to this podcast would agree. So appreciate you once again, joining us, Be sure to like, and follow our podcast, practically ranching. And we look forward to this second season with you.
callahan-grund_1_01-23-2023_105933Oh gosh, when Kind of, when they were coming out with all this Livestock somebody needs to do a podcast. And a buddy of my I were it. somebody needs to do a podcast. We're know, real. Applicable across the, across the segments and, and then, and then practical. And then yours came out and like, well, Matt's already doing it. You know, need. That's a good fill there. No, I, I, I got to where I was like, I don't know I have time or to do it. that's why I'd love to listening to yours I like, exactly what I It was void
Track 1front
callahan-grund_1_01-23-2023_105933yeah, that's why I really enjoyed.
Track 1Thanks for, uh, being with us today. How are things in or Pot County, Kansas?
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653They're good. They're wet? We got some snow on top of the ground here. Uh, hopefully sharing some moisture that, uh, the rest of the state desperately needed here. But it's a, it's a good, uh, bright, snowy morning.
Track 1good. So Callahan, you are the Executive Director of US Cattle Trace, is that correct?
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Yes, sir. It's the pay and day job anyways. That's, that's correct.
Track 1We won't go into everything else that you probably do, uh, but we will touch quite a bit on, on what you're doing on that day job. And before we get rolling. Yes, this is an animal ID focused podcast today and that may be a lightning rod for some, that might be something exciting for others. I have to share a little bit of my history on this front because I banged my head against the wall for a lot of years on the animal ID and traceability front in my old day job working for the American Angus Association, and I probably haven't ever even shared this with you, but I started. With the Angus Association in their office for a few years. I was out in the field and then I moved into St. Joseph, uh, on December the 30th of 2000. And by my first week of the job, a guy walks in and said, Hey, one of the things that you're gonna get to do is start going to these animal ID meetings because I'm sick and tired of them. I've been going for six months, and we talk about the same things over and over. So that was in late 2000, I think my first, meeting was in the spring of 2001, and at that time, the alphabet soup of ID had things like the US Animal Identification Plan, and there was one precursor to that that I can't even remember what before the U S A I P. But I went to these meetings for four years before I association. Moved back here in the spring of oh four. And as I have read articles and, and everything else that, uh, that you and others have written, in a lot of ways y'all are still talking about of the same issues we were back
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653very much
Track 1before the turn of the century.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's exactly right.
Track 1give us, um, give us your perspective on where we are today with a true animal traceability program and then we'll talk about some of the advantages to producers. Cuz this is one thing I want sure of as we, as we talk about this today. Uh, everything we talk about is very focused on the production side of the business. And yeah, there can be value and, and things to an ID program outside of Cal calf producers and, and, and folks like that. But I wanna focus on what's in it for us. What's in it for the guy or gal that's, that's running a hundred cows or a thousand cows, or whatever the case may be in terms of having a standardized animal ID program for them.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Great point. Good starting point. I think there, Matt, I, you know, one of the, the largest things is traceability is a really broad term when we talk about it without, within the industry. Um, you know, it can mean one thing to me. And, uh, another thing to you when we're talking about traceability and when we talk about traceability as it relates to US Cattle trace that's talking about, uh, disease traceability and, and, you know, more of a, uh, what you wanna say, standardized, you know, national disease traceability system. From our side, it's, uh, a voluntary standardized national disease traceability system. And, uh, you know, there's, there's a lot of benefits, a lot of components to where we are today. I'll speak specifically on cattle trace with a little bit of historical background and knowledge there. Cattle trace originated as a US cattle trace originated as a pilot project originally called Cattle Tracee. Um, back in 2018, it was kind of, uh, born out of, uh, two different, uh, events that simultaneously back to back the first being the, the Kansas Agricultural Growth Summit, which is hosted by the, the governor and the, um, secretary of. Each fall in the state of Kansas focused on how do we grow agriculture within the state? And they break out to agriculture in all the different sectors. And in the beef room that year, the top priority was, building a nationally significant disease traceability system, to really protect ourselves as beef producers. And that kind of got the wheel rolling. people started exploring, having some conversations. And then in December, that year in the k l a feeder council, meeting, they had voted for, uh, pursuing or, or looking at what a nationally significant disease traceability system would look like for all classes of cattle. So, you'll remember a little bit about 10 years ago, U S D A had, a traceability rule put into place. And so that'd be for cattle over the ages of 18 months. Basically anything moving interstate. So breeding cattle over the ages of 18 months. Dairy cattle, cattle for exhibition rodeo, the, just to name a few of 'em there. So any of those cattle cross and state lines need to have an official form of ID and be, you know, accompanied by A A C V I paper. All, all of us know that, with breeding cattle, you know, most of. Would note that system, as you know, the metal banks tags that you put in your ears, the orange clips or the metal bright tags that they may call 'em there as well, or you may know those as the eight 40 R F I D tags, which hit the news waves last week. for a lot of folks, uh, U SDAs currently putting in an amendment, to that rule transitioning to all R F I D tags for those classes of cattle. So they would be doing away with those metal tags and just having the eight 40, which is the US official designated, which we could get into later on. but, those, those R F I D tags for, um, use on all those cattle official IDs. So that started back then, really got things going in a pilot project format. And so the pilot project in Kansas was. Really thought of how can we do this from end to end? We have this rule in place for breeding cattle, but there's a big missing puzzle piece. You know, these feeder cattle, the cattle that moved the most in our country and ultimately make up the biggest know, chunk of our food supply chain. You know, they're not covered under this, uh, traceability rule. How, how can we maybe start looking at some of those, uh, areas and opportunities in this pilot project since it's a little different than what we have in place today? And, and how can we make it, you know, what I'm gonna call a true contact tracing system that allows us, you know, really quickly, rapidly and accurately to do a, a traceback on those animals. And so we looked at. A lot of different things. We looked at the technology. So number one, can the technology and infrastructure handle it? Can it be scaled up? And then also, you know, what's the you know, economics behind that at that point. And so, that started during that time. And simultaneously there were some other traceability projects going on, across the us. One of comparing the basically of low frequency and ultra high frequency, the two different R F I D tags out there in the marketplace, in, in what those look like through the life of those cattle. And so we joined all those efforts up in January of 2020, to form what is now US Cattle Trace, which is a nonprofit organization solely focused on a voluntary, nationally significant contact tracing system to be used by animal health officials in case of for disease outbreak. A lot of components to what we do, but at the very core and premise of it, it's You know, if you, if you're just looking at this for purely disease traceability, you know, those cattle, um, would be tagged once they leave the ranch of origin. So if it's your feeder cattle go into the sail barn, or if it's a breeding, uh, cow that's leaving the herd at 12 years of age when they first leave that ranch of origin, having an official ID in their ear, uh, R F I D tag at this point for speed of commerce, they would be then red at, uh, subsequent points of co-mingling. So if we think about, you know, maybe the, uh, the old traditional way of cattle flowing, uh, cattle would leave the ranch, go to the sale barn. Then go to the feed yard and then ultimately the packing plant. And so at the, you know, sale barn, auction market, feed yard and then the, the packing plant, those animals would be red. We'd collect four minimum points of data. It'd just be that id the date, time, and location. When we were first going through this, we asked animal health officials, what, what's the bare minimum you need to do at traceback? And that was, that was one that was very popular. It was. We just need the animal ID date, time, and location. We don't get any producer information. Um, nothing that's, you know, personal identifiable information. It's just purely that animal ID date, time, and location. And so, know, what that gives us the opportunity to do then, or gives animal health officials the regulatory ones, you know, test with keeping our industry safe from a disease outbreak standpoint. It gives them the opportunity to, to do what's a contact trac. And honestly, Matt, that used to be the hardest thing for us to explain, uh, when we first started and then Covid happened and everybody knows what contact tracing is now. And so, you know, whether it was your kid at daycare or whatever it may be, uh, when the, when the human health were calling us up on it. So, that would be kind of the core premise on it. Uh, we have a lot of different components, which I know we'll get into today. But, you know, I think what really kind of spurred the moment and to your kind of original question of where we're at today and where we've came since some of your early work, I think. You know, some of the early work that was done about 20 years ago on this was with low frequency id. And, you know, it was starting to really work. But if you think about the traditional way that cattle flow and you know, primarily in the Midwest here where you and I are located, where we're running really large groups of cattle through, that really changed the way that we did speed of commerce within businesses. You think about auction markets trying to run 2,500 head through in a day in a single file alley. the opportunity for risk and injury that happened at some of those facilities that tried to do that, you know, I think it just put some of those folks in a, well, I don't really wanna go through all the time and effort that it takes to change the way I do this. Uh, today at Cattle Trace. I wanna clarify, we u utilize both forms of R F I D, low frequency and old dry frequency. In the pilot project we just looked at ultra high frequency and what that kind of allowed a traceability system to do was operate what I'm gonna say, the background of the cattle industry cattle would flow. you had readers set up in the right, um, format in, in place, uh, you know, this cattle would flow through those facilities. Nothing would change in terms of their normal flow. It'd pick up, uh, you know, very, very, very high percentage of those cattle just like you would with a low frequency and be able to do within a subsequent trace back if we ever needed to within the database that, know, US Cattle Trace owns. And that, that's where I think got, uh, people kind of reinvigorated it this time. You know, the technology offered us a unique opportunity to, know, look at what it could work like in a speed of commerce, format and setting for folks and not have to change the way that they do business.
Track 1uh, that's a really good explanation of where we are and where we've come from. And, and as you talk about these different technologies, it, it reminds me of some of those meetings again, back in the early 2000 to 2003 or four time period, we'd always get bogged down with the technology. Are we going to use at that time hanging tags and write 'em down? Are we gonna use barcodes? Which was the end thing And then of course, RFIDs had been around, but, uh, the readability of those was, was, was a question mark. I remember one person though, speaking at one of these meetings that said, you know, folks, we can sit around and wait all we want for the technology, but the technology is rarely the limiting factor. It's our paradigm and it's our ability to, to understand that, yeah, there are, there's some fear factor to this of big brother watching and all but that's probably the bigger thing to get over than the technology. So if we wait for the technology, we're, we're never gonna get this thing off the ground. But like you said, I, I think a couple of things, readers and, and better IDs, uh, that are, that have better read rates. And then the other thing is, I would guess that when you talk about Id date, time, and location is that location that you're recording a gps.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Yes, sir. Yep.
Track 1was something at the time, I don't think I had ever heard GPS 2001. And we had, and we didn't Google it on our phone because we
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Yeah. You weren't giggling,
Track 1the thing. Yeah, we had, we had premises IDs that you go on, fill out your physical address and that was the big hangup was what if the premise's ID of the person that owns the cattle is two states away from location where the animal resides and its custodial care. And so in that respect, technology really has helped make this a lot simpler because now whatever reader you have can say where it was that it was when it scanned these and, and that takes care of, of not having to have a physical address and a post office and or a mailbox and things
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Sure. But what's really interesting with that, Matt, I think is, is so, okay. So the things you heard back then, the limiting factors were technology. it, it's, how are we gonna do this? What if we have to upgrade the technology into the future? You know, we don't want to have to keep buying this every 10 years, 20 years, whatever it may be. you know, we hear a lot of those same things today, is interesting. You know, we've progressed technology so much in that amount of time, but we hear the exact same. reasonings. And so when you start thinking about what, okay, so what's really our limiting factor here within the beef cattle industry, we're one of major beef exporting countries in the world that don't have a traceability system for their country, whether it's voluntary or mandatory. that's us in India. And India, you know, primarily exports water buffalo. so that pretty much leaves the US and we, we all know we raised the highest quality, best tasting, safest protein in the world, within the US beef cattle industry. but you know, it's limited our ability sometimes to market, sometimes, to prove, safety of that, whether, you know, it's. Phony regulation, uh, for another country. So what's really our limiting factor there in You know, I think what you talked about there, it's, it's our ability to really, in the US us beef cattle industry change, you know, disruption and change within our minds. You know, we're, we're all guilty of it in, in some form or fashion within our operations to, to accept change and move on to whatever it may be. Uh, that'll help us increase our efficiencies and operations because that's just the way we've always done things. Matt. Um, You know, whether it's your tagging system, your, the color of tags you have, uh, the technology that you use, uh, the cost to, to utilize that. I, I think that's really where, where we've boiled this down to is it's, it's really just hard for people to expect, uh, accept change in some of these former facets. And there's certainly a lot of different other components and, and barriers to that. But, uh, at the root of a lot of this, it's, it's ability for change. It's really gonna get this done within the US beef cattle industry if we, if we do it this time properly with disease traceability.
Track 1and that's the tough part of it is getting past this, this fear of change and fear of the unknown and doing things differently. Um, and I think the other part of it is every time that I have heard a producer who has been offered a new technology, new management, Any, any kind of change. We can talk vaccine programs, we can talk, timing of, of marketing and, anything that I can think of that would make them do something different, something more, something that they hadn't done first generations, what's the first question that they have?
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653what's it gonna cost? What's it gonna cost?
Track 1And then the next question, who's gonna pay me to do it? What am I gonna get out of this additional cost? uh, I think most ranchers are, are businessmen enough that, I mean, we can see it however, many years ago when Japan implemented the 20 month instead of the 30 month rule for imported beef, when Japan would only buy beef that could be verified 20 months and younger, guess what A lot of folks went to a tagging program that, verified that those cattle were, were being harvested before 20 months of age. they spent three bucks on a tag and on our f e and everything because they knew they were gonna make 30 bucks or more. as soon as that Japan market went away, they pulled, I mean, they
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653It went That's right.
Track 1So, so I guess my question to you, and I think the one on a lot of peoples who are listening to this minds, what's in it for what is the value or potential value of an ID program? And, and granted, this gets really convoluted because I think you all have done it right by making it where it. Serve varieties of a variety of purposes, but let's get at the core, just the ID for traceability. use what's in it for the cow calf producer by putting that tag in there.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653yeah, great question. And it is the one that we get always, um, at, at the top of, you know, ever since I've been a part of this five years ago that we started this, that's always been the top question. And I think it, you know, we're really good as Cal calf producers, myself being one as well. I think you had on one of your previous podcasts that said, you when we look at profitability within each segment of the industry, you know, feed yard, they know pretty much this is what they can get based upon the markets, auction markets, this, they're, you know, being margin operators, Cal s so variable, you know, we're entering a time where it's gonna be a lot of profits, hopefully, um, you know, where we just came off a, maybe really, really, really tight margins there. And so our costs are very val variable and it's a good question to ask within that you're putting into your new program and, and one that's definitely warranted when I start thinking. US Cattle Trace. And what's the, what's the benefit? Obviously the first one, uh, the, these, the, the first big ones are, are non, um, really quick to tangible. Um, you know, so it's, it, it is protection of our beef cattle industry. If you look at, you know, what happened, to towards the tail end of your work with ID with the cow that stole Christmas, and our ability to regain those markets quickly, know, that one was, that one's huge. You know, you look at the Japan market and how long it took us to get back into the Japan market. It, you know, it was crazy. Uh, you know, the amount of that, and that was just, Because we didn't have the ability to just snap our fingers and prove that cow from Canada across the border just to, you know, get harvested at that point. Um, you know, if we could have done that at, at the snap of fingers, I don't believe we would've probably lost any export markets at that time. And, you know, that kind of kick started the first triad disease traceability with this. And, um, you know, we never got over that hurdle or hump because of the issues we talked about earlier. But, you know, I think we have an even bigger opportunity here to be proactive for once I, I say that we're really good as, uh, in the cattle industry at being reactive to these issues. but we have an opportunity, I think, to be proactive here because we have been fortunate to not have a major disease outbreak for over a hundred, you know, close to a hundred years on whatever, on, you know, foot and mouth disease in that instance. And, folks that live within a tuberculosis Bruce area up north, you know, I when they say, well, what's the liability to me? I think they. Get excited when we start walking through this because this gives us the opportunity to say, it's not me in this situation. There was a TB outbreak, uh, in South Dakota, gosh, uh, over two years ago now. Uh, that took about 18 months for them to work through and the narrowest net they could cast to, know, bleed all those cattle and work through. It was her 90 herds that sold black cattle on that auction market that day. It only came from one, but it was 90 of 'em. They had to test because that was the narrowest net they could cast, and so gave those folks that opportunity that, so when you think about. You know, major economically significant diseases. This gives you an opportunity to almost, you know, prove it, uh, against yourself. That you're doing the right things, that your, your animals weren't part of that in that instance. And not to say that somebody was doing a wrong thing if a disease were to enter like that. but you know, it gives you that opportunity. But I don't think we have to look any further math than the, the poultry or pork industry to see, you know, massive economically, significant, disease outbreaks that are, you know, driving, know, the supply that they have at this point. You know, everybody. Thinks that the price of eggs is going up dramatically just because of inflation, and I just, I hate to break it to 'em. We had some bad H P A I cases that happened this fall that shut down some major, major, um, egg producers in our country for over six months. You know, that's, that's economically significant. Then at that point. And you look at the swine industry, you know, with, uh, African swine fever knocking on our doorstep being done in the Dominican Republic. know, these are, these are diseases that we're not used to, we're not accustomed to in the US because we do do a really good job. Our regulatory animal health officials do a really good job keeping that out. So this just keeps our businesses going. This keeps our livelihoods going into the future. you know, you think, another podcast you were on, you were on Matt, with Joe Goggins starting to talk about how the, these rural communities are driven by agriculture and, uh, know, what keeps those rural communities going that many of us live in, is our businesses, right, is agricultural producers. And so, know, ha taking that step to protect our livelihood for not only ourselves, but maybe the next generation, you know, from a major massive disease outbreak that would a lot of people out of business. Matt, I think is probably the biggest driving factor. And that's that, like I said, that's really hard because it's not tangible. It's not something we can see, feel, or touch every day, until that were to occur. And so, I, I think that's probably the biggest driving factor into this, Matt, and then, If you wanna start looking at ancillary benefits, you know, you start looking at the technology and what can I do outside of that? So at Cattle Tracee, we've always said, and we always will be solely focused on animal disease traceability. Makes it hard for us to drive true profit for you, but what the technology can do can drive a lot of true profit for you. And there's a lot of companies and there's a lot of folks taking advantage of the, the things and the data that they can capture. Now as we enter this age of big data to start making more informed decisions on it, so what our envision is in into the future is that we are building the infrastructure system, uh, the highway system for that tag and the, and the supply chain, through each segment of the industry You know, if you want to tie in whatever information you want to as part, whatever part of, uh, your supply chain or your value added program you're a part of, you can do that with that tag and the data over here on the right hand side and on the left hand side, you know, we can peel off just those, minimal points of data for disease traceability. And so you start getting an ancillary benefit from the technology. And to be honest with you, Matt, the audit only really comes through a voluntary system like this when we start mandating, uh, the ability to do. you and I for us to differentiate our product then from our neighbor down the road. we maybe don't get that opportunity if we're both doing the exact same thing. But you know, for the early adopters and innovators here, you're gonna have an opportunity to capture, as much data as you want with the time and effort you put into it, to really differentiate yourself for whatever aspect you're wanting to do from a marketing standpoint with your cabs into the future. So there's some, a, a lot of added benefits through that there as well, Matt. And then you start looking at the operational efficiencies, not to call out another one of your podcasts, but with Lamar Steiger talking about the VAR codes and the operational that that brought to each segment of wherever it's implemented. You know, the world runs off of 'em now. I think you can do that within your own operat. know, whether you're making decisions to coal cows and our fertility into the future, um, or the, you know, you're really focused on feed efficiency within your operation. This technology gives you a lot of added benefits to do it may be that you want to with it, um, from an operational efficiency standpoint.
Track 1Yeah. uh, to go back to those old days that I was sitting in the meetings that now you are that was always my argument as they said, we've gotta make this mandatory. We've gotta make sure we get everybody to get on this system so we can trace back If we have, god forbid, a, a hoof and mouth or foot and mouth disease outbreak. That's the one that we've gotta be quicker than however long. You said it took on that, on that, uh, trace back of, of tb, we don't have that kind of time. We don't have weeks. We don't, we definitely don't have months. We've got hours, a lot of cattle or are infected. So we've gotta force people into this, and my thought again 20 some years ago, right at 20, why don't we make this the base that you can use if and when we, God forbid, ever have to use it in a disease trace back, but let's use the same number. to go into this other system that provides some premiums and some benefits and some ways that you can stand behind your product and say, I want people to know that I raised it. that's gonna create huge premiums for everybody in the, in the sector and segments that, that use that. And, I think as in, in my distant view of what you all have done with cattle trays, it's, it's exactly that. And, and I wasn't the only one that was A lot of us were saying that, but to me, that demand pull type of scenario that, um, allows people who want to do the right thing for the industry, i e have a way that if and when we ever need to use this from a traceback standpoint, it's there, but get paid to do the thing, uh, as well. And so I think there's, there's huge value, um, in that. let's talk just, I guess the, the. Practical use of these tags. So when you get to talking about using both or, or accepting both low frequency and ultra high frequency, what are we talking about? Those are all the button RFIDs. how are those different and then costs and advantages and disadvantages to both of those technologies?
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Sure. that's a good distinguishing factor. low frequency are the button tags. You guys, uh, you know, everybody that's listening, um, you've been with those tags or seen those tags for 20 plus years at this point. Um, you know, if you're wanting to gather carcass data on your operation or you're using it for management purposes, that's the technology that's been around for a long time ultra. And, you know, those tags have a read range of about 18 inches. You have the wands, you know, um, that's really popular way to read those. You also have panel readers, so, you know, if you're running cattle down an alleyway or, or if you're at shoot side or, you can mount panels onto those, uh, chutes or alleyways and still pick up the reads on those tags. And so they're really good use. Uh, I'm gonna liken this all to a tool tag system. So they're really good use of, you know, when we first, were transitioning away from, um, you know, stopping and putting change in, stopping and putting change in would be, you know, Restraining an animal, reading a tag, moving on with life. When we first started, you know, you'd slow down to 35, 45 mile an hour, whatever it may be, and it'd pick up that read, um, on your K tag system or tool tag, and then you could kind of keep driving a little, you know, back to interstate speed. ultra high frequency is a technology that's been around for quite a while, but you know, within the cattle industry, it's been about 10 to 15 years at this point, and it would be, You don't have the ability within the cattle industry, um, it's in a panel tag type setting. So it's a, it's a visual dangled tag. Most of the time. It can be read up to 30 to 40 feet if you tune your reader up high enough. And so you can run big droves of cattle down an alleyway, one, 200,000, whatever it may be, you know, and pick up those cattle as they run down that alleyway. we've gotten a lot of that technology as an industry to a point where you're getting into the upwards up, up high nineties percent of Reed range, which is very similar to low frequency than at that point, which know, going back to, uh, the pilot project a lot, you know, made more pe some of these different factions, um, within segments of the industry, more comfortable, you know, okay, I can now, I'm a sail barn. I can run through however many, you know, load lots of cattle I need to, or, know, I'm gonna feed yard. I want to, I wanna make sure I don't have a know, a hot steer going, um, for an n HTC program, whatever it may be, or a, you know, non-antibiotic program, know, they can pick 'em up in an alleyway then at that point. And, know, get a lot of those. That'd be like, you know, running down the interstate at 75 mile an hour with your K ttag and it's picking it up and, um, working through at that point. So those would be kind of the two technologies, but they're both radio frequency IDs. And I want to really hammer home that point, Matt, because I think a lot of times, people may sit there and go, well, you can gain a lot of information from those tags. Well, if you think about how that tag truly operates, it's just that readers is sitting there know, buzzing, uh, a radio frequency out and that tag's got the panel in. It just picks it up. So alls you can put in that panel, in that tag is about a, is about a number. So those 15 digit numbers, that's the max amount of information pretty much that you can put into one of those tags. And so, I don't know whose tag it is, I don't know what anything is related to know, it's just picking up that tags number. You say you sit there and you go, how's, how's all that data then kind of transplant? Well, that's all on the reader and data management side then. So know, these software companies and these tech gus that are way smarter than I am, you know, they'll, they'll hook that reader up with their software. So when that picks up that read, you can then input whatever information you want. And so next time when you utilize, uh, you know, another reader on your operation, you know, have that other information tied to it. But if you just think about the core premise of the technology, it's just that tag picking up that, or that reader picking up that tag number and that's it. So anything else tied to the backside is, is all, um, u use your, uh, inputted data then at that point.
Track 1And I think a critical part of that to, to make sure and drive home as well is access to that information is only given by whoever is part. you said, the software application. So, on that tag, nothing is, nothing is married to that tag except that 15 digit, eight 40 identification number, past that. If it, if that is entered into U S D a's system, then they can find out, ID date, time, and location. Calf first entered commerce at Livestock Market or whatever, or in my case, if it's or your case, your family's case, if it's a seed stock animal, we may put that into a software application that gives us its genomic profile and its EPDs and its pedigree and, and everything that we've ever done to that animal. It's up to us then to say, who gets to see that in addition to us. Maybe nobody, maybe our breed association. It may be our customers, it may be, you know, in the case of, of fed cattle, it may be the feed yard that we're sending those to. But it, it, it's our decision whether anybody gets to see anything more than a 15 digit number that tells us nothing about that animal's location or anything. Right.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's right. And, and if I'm sitting here and I'm listening to this, Matt, I'm, I'm, I'm on all in, on disease traceability at this point. Right. You know, I'm a producer. I'm, I'm good with letting you have those four pieces of data. I want to know more about this. Why, why isn't US Cattle Trace doing, why aren't you doing more value add to, to help pull this through? we could go down so many rabbit holes and what we think, know, could add value for producers. But, you know, to be honest, if I went through and I built Cattle trace's system with me, what makes me value, you and I are both seed stock producers, I guarantee we'll have different, inputs or different information that we'd want to gather with that. Um, just as to, to like seed stock producers, let alone, a guy with 40 head and a guy versus 2000 head on a commercial side, you know, it's helpful to us to just be focused on animal disease traceability. That's always only gonna be our focus because that helps us, Get the first priority done, uh, a nationally significant voluntary contact tracing system. But if we're successful in that, that also helps provide that infrastructure for anybody to tack on any, data set, uh, you know, database or software company to, to make money on their own operation. That's where the true value I think of the technology comes into this Then Matt, is that, you know, they can custom build it to make them and maximize profitability on their own operation to their utmost degree. Then, utilizing the technology and whatever form or facet they want, and the ancillary benefit really becomes then, you know, disease traceability and, and being protected if, like you say, God forbid we ever had to use the system at that point.
Track 1And you've done, you've done two critical things I think, that enable a new technology or a new system, to work in business. You've simplified it, you've
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653right.
Track 1bare bones and then whatever, however you want to use it, go somewhere else. And you've allowed us as farmers and ranchers to maintain our independence. And that's that's, anytime we make a decision, I don't care, dollars, cents, whatever else. We want to have the independence to do what we want with the program, with the number, with the information and things like that. So back to dollars and cents, do you actually sell the IDs to folks and what is a cost or a cost range on both the low frequency, ultra high frequency, and then of course the readers, if we choose to put one of those our place, which isn't a necessity, right? If just want to let somebody else
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's exactly
Track 1access to that, you don't have to have a reader. But go through those, I guess, four different things, readers and tags for low frequency and ultra high frequency.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Sure. Yeah, that's a good question. Sorry, I skipped over that earlier. Uh, getting into the cost is, is certainly important, um, for everybody on their operations. So you think about the cost of a low frequency tag, uh, I'm gonna throw an average out there of probably $2. Um, but you know, that could range anywhere from a dollar 70 fives the lowest one I've seen out there to, you know, $3 if you're getting into a really customized type tag for your operation. And then likewise, within, ultra high frequency, it would follow about the same range there on a dollar 77, to about three and a half. So there, there was only one official form of id. In, in ultra high frequency tags. That company has since kind of gone off the off the radar. Um, they're, they're not selling tags into the US market anymore right now at this point, we'll still to be seen if they come back into the market. So most of those would be 900 series tags. So if you think about, like all flex's designation is a 9 82. Um, when they start that, uh, data Mars has a different, uh, in yx all these different tag manufacturers for their just, stock tags, I'm gonna call 'em, have different, uh, designations, which means anybody can just go buy 'em off the shelf. within that eight 40 designation, which is the USS official code. Um, so Mexico has one, Canada has one, you know, Germany has one. All these different countries have a official code that starts within the 15 digits. If you want an official form of id, then you do have to have a premise ID number at that point. which is basically just saying, like you said earlier, I, I'm Callahan Grand and Wago Kansas, and my cows reside here at this address. That's all that premise ID number is. And um, so if they ever have to do a trace back to that specific tag, or when you buy those tags, then um, that tag manufacturer distributor shares that information and says, Callahan Graham bought these 15 tags and they can do that. Now, how often does that happen? know, it depends on whatever the disease is and what that looks like from a regulatory animal health standpoint, but they, they can do that today with your, uh, metal banks tags as well. I, I wanna make that known as well. so that, that is an important distinction there at that point. And so, those would be kind of the two costs of that. good point. You do not have to have a reader if you're sitting here as a cal calf producer to listening to this saying, you know, I want to do this. I wanna participate for disease traceability. do I have to buy a reader? No, you don't have to buy a reader. Um, if you want to use this technology like we talked about earlier on your operation, you might explore looking at a reader to, for whatever use you may have on the ranch, but you don't need to for this. And, and, uh, those readers would then be at, you know, in auction markets, feed yards and the, and then the packer, maybe a backgrounder in there as well. And those readers on the low frequency side, they're pretty standard out there. I'd have to look up, uh, you know, a more recent, number on those. Uh, within the ultra high frequency side of things, you know, you can buy a little box reader that can mount over your chute, and those are pretty cost effective. 700 to, you know, $1,200, somewhere in there. Uh, or you could kind of go for Taj Mahal, uh, you know, Rover's Alley full setup there, which would be about five to $7,000 in that range. But a low frequency reader, you know, I'd have to look up that, uh, reader at this point. I haven't, I haven't priced one of those lately, Matt, to know what those costs.
Track 1Yeah, and I, I should know that as well. But, I guess another question that I've had before, and I know with the low frequency, this was not, very effective, but with the read range, I think you said on these ultra high frequency of 30 or 40 feet, are they getting readers where, if I have an R F I D, ultra high frequency, R F I D in a cow in a pasture scenario, and I want to read her from the pickup window. Can I get one animal or how far away from everybody else does she have to be for me
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653How tame are your cows?
Track 1Well, it depends on the one.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Yeah, sure. No, you do see, they, they do have handheld readers, uh, you know, for, um, old try frequency, and I just did a quick Google search here while we're on the phone. Those low frequency readers would be around 1200 bucks. It looks like there, um, 12 to $1,300. So, uh, and that would be very similar to an ultra high frequency handheld reader too, I believe. but those tags get more, you know, if you want to get, ensure really good read range, you're looking at more like eight to 15 feet, at that point. know, the reason I said the really tame ones, one of the, when we first started doing this about five years ago, there was a pin of feed lot cattle and I just, at the bunk while they, while they ate, I just drove back and forth from the pickup, you know, extended my arm out there as far as I could. And I think I picked up, you know, probably the first one at the bunk and then the second row. But I wasn't quite picking up that third row, which would be about, you know, probably more like 20 feet away when we got to that point. you know, I just kept driving back and forth and I'd pick up one from that point. So you definitely can, there's some reader setups as well. So you think about like going and cake in your cows or unrolling a bale form or something like that. In the wintertime, there's some of these companies that are, basically hardwire and a reader to, Top, I'm gonna say the top of your flatbed there, you know, right by the box. know, wiring that into the, into the pickup battery, more juice you get the battery rearranges you can get at that point. And so, you know, what they were really selling was, especially in a brushy type area, you know, wanting to make sure all your cows came to eat, you know, they were going through, you know, feed unroll a bale or cake 'em, and then drive around them and you could pick up the reads on those and you have your little tablet set up in your pickup at that point. So there's some neat applications that people are starting to take, know, those readers and, and wire 'em up and, make 'em useful for, however, you know, the producer wants to use it at that point.
Track 1Well, it's pretty exciting stuff. I mean, you know, we, we think about one of the biggest jobs we have as a custodian of animals is getting a count. And if we have cows in a pasture, we count 115, we roll on, uh, counting by twos and them moving
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's right.
Track 1quite often it's possible to miss one. You know, we talk 90 something percent read rates on these IDs, and sometimes people say, well, if it's not a hundred, I'm not gonna do it. Well, we, as much as we'd like to think that we're always exact with our um, that's, I, I mean even just something as little as that would be pretty powerful. The other thing is if you're one short, you know who you're short
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's exactly right.
Track 1why? It might be, let's say she was the first one we AIed and, and guess what? She's probably in to draw a cabin right now and you better be looking for a baby.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's exactly right.
Track 1I, I, I think it opens up an immense amount of possibilities and that's why it's so unfortunate that quite often in the beef industry, when we hear animal ID or traceability, we immediately put up a roadblock and say, this is a bad deal. When in actuality, my mind. As anybody who's listened to this podcast can attest is pretty out there sometimes, but my mind goes to saying how exciting, think of the, the ways that we can use this to be better managers of cattle and to know more about these, these animals, even if we want, even after they leave our, our place. getting data back from a feed yard that bought them and we agreed to give them the ID number in trade to get the carcass data back or, or some, you know, things like that I think are just the sky's the limit really of
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Well, and, and it, I think it's gonna be more crucial as we move into the future. Right Matt? So to talking about listen to one of your previous podcasts, I think this was, this hit me super powerful. I don't know if it hit any of the rest of your listers, super powerful. But when you were talking to Lamar, and I think he was, I believe he was talking to his son, uh, that does blockchain there within Walmart, and he said, dad, if I had to guess, people are gonna have to be part of supply chains moving forward, within whatever faction it is, whether you're selling lettuce or, or you know, beef cattle at that point, you know, working into your supply chains to know, with genetics or information or whatever it may be. You know, we're gonna have to start gathering more of this information and. I think it's important for us to listen and listen to ourselves sometimes cuz you know, a lot of us as, uh, cow calf producers also farm, um, in certain portions of the country. We have no problem hopping in our tractor with auto steer and sharing all that information with John Deere to make our lives easier when we're on a tractor, but we we're scared of Big Brother When we get into the pasture with our cattle there at that point, if we can utilize that data to better ourselves and better our operations, just like you said, the sky's the limit at that point. And, I think it'll be more crucial for, you know, each of us as producers moving forward to really, take a look at how we can, you know, better utilize, uh, ourselves and our opportunities for not only marketability of our cattle, but you bettering the beef supply chain at the end of the day.
Track 1again, the many perspectives of the beef industry are either really, really interesting or really, really frustrating. And that independent nature of cattle producers is, is what, um, is what. So great about our industry, but also makes it so challenging when, quite often maybe even a vocal minority, raises enough of a ruckus that, the rest of the industry that may be excited or potentially excited by technology like this, uh, don't even get an opportunity to use it. So I, I think, I think the way you all are doing this and, and keeping it voluntary and, and, uh, letting people choose what and who they want to use and share this information with, I think it's, it's, it's really smart. I asked about readers and I asked about types of identification, technology, low frequency, ultra high frequency. would you say that the best way to choose if we have a, uh, cow calf producer who hasn't ever used RFIDs maybe in bangs, vaccinating heifers, and so doesn't even have a, a national ID in their ear, if they say, Hey, I want to use this for my own benefit, whether marketing and telling that story better on feeder calves that I'm selling, whether it be, um, adopting a system that I can maintain individual IDs of all my cows and put data into a computer, would their best bet be to find that software application or that company that, that does what they want them to do and then say, what Id, do I need to participate with you? Is that, is
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Yes. That, that would be, yeah. That's a great, question and ask there, Matt, because, you know, because we have not, know, taken a, a step into that arena, on purpose we didn't because there's so many good people out there, companies that do that. Um, you know, we, we don't need to be doing that. That's, that's, those companies are good at it. Done it for years, uh, let them be involved. So yeah, as a producer, get into know, work with those data management providers. We've worked really hard to try to partner up with those folks, you know, try to, uh, learn about their companies, figure out what they do. So when folks come to us and say, Hey, I'm really trying to do this. Do you guys have any leads for me? I can say, yeah, here's two or three companies here. here's some contact. Get, you know, get after it with them then at that point, and also we, yeah, we don't sell tags. I, I don't think I answered that question earlier from you as well, so, um, because there are, An enormous amount of tag manufacturers and distributors that make, uh, really high quality tags. You know, um, we want you to have the freedom to choose whatever tag it works best for you and your operation, whether it's a low frequency tag or an ultra high frequency tag, whatever it may be, and a fully saturated system into the future. Cattle Trace will just be focusing on that contact tracing database. Um, and, you know, being serving as that white picket fence in between and. know, regulatory animal health officials there. So, you know, because at the end of the day, Matt, that's, that's the crux of what we're trying to do, is to help them, know, better do their jobs as regulatory animal health officials. And we're all a bunch of producers. you know, our board of directors is, have been great, great leaders in this, and they're only made up of members of cattle tracee from the cow calf auction market or feed yard segment. That's those three segments are the only ones. Dairy and backgrounders, they go into the equation too. But if we're looking at that traditional format, only those three. And so, you know, we want, you know, they're independent cattlemen just like you guys are. They want to allow you to have the opportunity to choose your data management system, your, uh, tag company. Uh, we're just focused on trying to get that, you know, nationally significant voluntary contact tracing system and into play there at that point. And so, question. I think, uh, you know, as, as we look forward to that, we want to try to connect folks in that best realm. We have, uh, a tag store up on our website to just give people an opportunity. It's, but think about it as an Amazon tag store front. It's all those tag manufacturers and distributors. They just put their tags on there. The orders go straight to them. We just made more easily accessible for producers by putting it on a website, because that was kind of something that had never been out there before. So that is a distinguishing factor there.
Track 1and I would encourage anybody to, to go to your website, cattle trace.org and, and look through that leadership. it's kind of a who's who of the beef industry from, gosh, six or eight or nine different states. And you've got, you know, leading seed stock producers. You've got managers and and owners of some of the biggest commercial cal calf herds around. I mean, the four six s You, you've got sale barn owners and managers. these are folks that, aren't just in it because it's part of their. Association job or whatever that that case may be. These are producers that, that realize that even just at its stripped down bare bones minimum, there is enough value in a traceability system to all of us that are, are trying to do the right thing and tell the story of the beef industry that it's worth being on, you know, this leadership and adopting these types of things. So I, I'd sure encourage folks to look there. So you used the analogy of a white picket fence. white picket fences don't go up for free or stay white for very long without putting some money into 'em. You all are a non-profit. How does cattle trace make its money or how, how, how is it funded so that you can even have a position.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653That's exactly right. And I, that was one of my first orders of business, Matt, when I was hired, uh, talk about a daunting task, uh, coming into a, a fresh with no non-profit organizational experience in the past. So we, uh, we did start with, uh, in, in currently have in place a membership model and, um, we've ran with it for about two years. It was launched in January of 2020. Um, so this would be, you know, entering our third year now at this point. Uh, and it, it's been a pretty good model, uh, where we landed on that, uh, the different, not only the different segments. We wanted to try to have all the different segments of the beef cattle industry that could be negatively impacted by a disease outbreak. And we probably don't even have it fully built out yet at this point with all those, but we have enough buckets I think that fit into it. So we have a cow calf slash individual producer. Um, we've got auction markets, we've got feed yards, which Backgrounders would fit into, you know, either a producer or feed yard dependent upon the size of their operation. Um, dairy cattle. And then we also have allied industry folks, associations, included in there as well. And so, you know, we sat there, what are we gonna make these membership dues? Uh, you know, we need to be funded on, uh, by membership. Oh, I forgot to mention the pack packing segment there as well. Excuse me. Um, they're. big crucial part of the food supply chain, obviously. Um, you know, so what are we gonna make these dues? And we went through that. The economics, I had touched on it at the beginning of the podcast of the, uh, pilot project. And so we looked at the economics, okay, what does it cost? Implement a traceability system. Not only what does it cost, but who stands to benefit the most from a traceability system. So as you can imagine, uh, the highest cost on a per head basis, I'm gonna put it on a per head, um, cost per head basis. the, the folks that stood to benefit the most paid the least on a traceability system at that point, uh, on the cost of implementing one. Um, and the folks that stood the benefit, the least amount from a traceability paid the most on a per head basis. So we really flipped that, um, model on its access when we made these membership dues. So for a cow calf producer, we wanted to make it free, but I had no good way to track it. So we made it $25 for a year. Um, it was an opportunity just. We were running it through PayPal at that time, and that was the only way I could track it without them taking all my money. So, um, you know, at that point. And so, uh, we don't make money off of cow calf memberships at US Cattle Trace by any means. And so auction markets, it's a hundred dollars feed yards is based, it's a tiered model based upon, um, Capacity of those yards. Uh, same thing with the Packers. It's, uh, based upon, um, harvested per day, um, at that point. And then, uh, allied industry and producer associations would be based upon gross revenue of those companies. And so, um, is it a perfect model? No, it's a pretty good starting point for us. We we're gonna continue to reevaluate that. We're just going through a strategic planning process right now, and that's one of our core, uh, init, uh, It's underneath one of our core initiatives with, you know, building financial strength and longevity of cattle traces to, um, you know, evalu continually reevaluate that model. And so we're due time for that. Wanna make sure that it's appropriate, but that is how we're funded at this point. Um, we also host a symposium every year, and that's funded a hundred percent on sponsorships from, um, folks within the industry. So it's free for folks to attend. Um, we typically have some pretty good, um, folks on the pod, uh, on the podcast. Excuse me. Um, folks speaking at the symposium, um, we had Brian McClendon, the, the founder of Google Earth two years ago, um, had Greg dod, uh, tell in China trade stories at this last symposium. And so, um, really good, um, you know, group that we try to get, uh, convened every year at that point. And that is funded by sponsorships. So that would be kind of the financial breakdown of where Cattle Trace is at.
Track 1Well, it's, it's really interesting and, and I think a great way of, of not just having members, but having members that see the value in it. And there's always value in that. I, um, as you did the Freudian slip of calling your symposium a podcast, you know, really all a symposium is, is an in-person
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653In-person podcast. That's right. forgot to mention there, Matt, on the membership side of things and that this would be foolish for me not to mention, so I, I did say that the board is made up of folks from the cow calf auction market, feedy yard segment. Those in the dairy, excuse me, those folks. able to vote on the board of directors as well. So, um, the packing segment, allied industry and producer associations do not get votes on the, on who is, uh, elected to the board of directors. And, and that all goes back to the data. So, um, why Cattle Trace does own the database and once the data flows into the database, it's cattle trace's data cuz we own the database. Um, you know, inputted into the system is producer data, so Cal calf producers, auction markets, feed yards, you know, that is producer data. Once it, you know, gets harvested at a packing plant, you know, it turns into beef at that facility. So, um, that's where the change of ownership occurs. We've, we tried to put some really good thought and process into, um, you know, who gets a say on that data and the access to that database because, um, you know, a, a traceback would be on the live animal side from, that standpoint. And so those folks are the only ones that are able to vote on the board of directors, nominate and have membership there.
Track 1Well, I think that's a good, good way to, to make that type of a situation work. Where, where it's the stakeholders that have uh, power and that that vote. well this is, this has been really, really informational for me. I know because like I said, I have been a little out of touch with the inner workings of any kind of, uh, national ID program. Uh, obviously we are supportive of that and, Little by little. We're using RFIDs on our place more and more just as a function of the Bruce Lotus, vaccination program. And, and our vets moved two or three years ago away from the metal clips and into the low frequency RFIDs. So we're getting, you know, every year we, we get another 15 or 20% of our cow herd on there just by, uh, by the replacement heifers. But honestly, in full disclosure, we have yet to adopt a software program that uses that R F I D, uh, of course being part of a breed association. We use the, the programs that the American Angus Association and, but from a management standpoint, I'm still on the hunt for that perfect program. I'm not sure, just like those stories from 20 years ago that I'll ever find it. it's there. I need to just, I mean, or close enough, I need to just take the step and, and find which one is, is, best for me. And I think that, we'll, we'll morph our management to be, uh, in line with that. But I, I, I think that's one of the things that we all have to, as producers on any technology, but specifically an application change. sophomore programs and IDs. we may have to do the Nike mantra and just do it and, try it. And then we'll, we'll figure it out. We always do. We'll figure out how it's gonna best work into our, our scenario. Um, I've got one thing to close this out, that as I was researching a little bit, some of the old names and I called it Alphabet soup of id, there was an article that my friend Wes Ishmail, when he was working with Beef Magazine, wrote, July 30th, 2018. So that would've been right about the start, correct, of Cattle Tracee. And I'm not even sure I didn't, I didn't read it in its entirety, but I don't think that it was even about cattle trays, but more just about the national Id. But Wes wrote, in some ways the industry finds itself, and again, this is 2018, in some ways, the industry finds itself back where it began with ID and traceability. No standardized national system capable of 48 hour trace back to the birth premises. And many of the original concerns still in search of consensus. The stark difference almost 20 years down the road is that the circle has now become a spiral. The industry is embarking on this next phase at a higher, more advanced level. Thanks to the immeasurable efforts of so many. To me that's the immeasurable efforts of so many is exactly what you all cattle trace are doing. And we're doing then and, and hopefully this, this vicious circle that has become a spiral. Eventually turns into a spiral in the right direction and, and propels us forward because I think there are way more opportunities than there are liabilities as we look at figuring out ways to identify this nation's cow herd and the calves that it produces. And not just for the US governments, um, U S D A E F S I S, whoever it might be to trace back in terms of a, of a disease outbreak, but also ensure us against the economic harm that that disease could, could cost us. And as a side benefit, gives us an opportunity to, to use some of these private programs and, and management that we can better, manage and then better market those calves, uh, to the.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Sure. if I could leave him with any, you know, with any one statement here, Matt. I think, my why on getting involved in this was as a producer was I did work at the Department of Ag in Kansas, uh, when I was at Kansas State. and then transitioned into a full-time career for about a year. And I sat there and saw, you know, we're one of the most prepared states in the nation. I went, man, and it still scared me, Matt. I was like, man, we're really not that prepared. And, and, and that's not a knock on our, our Department of Ag. They do an excellent job, but with the current tools in place, we're just, It just does not allow us the opportunity. And you know, I got involved saying there's gotta be a better way. I know there is as a producer to help, you know, bridge this gap. you know what? I'd really hate it for all of us, you know, to sit here and listen to this. get razed up and go. Um, that's great. And then we don't go do anything. And then something bad were, God forbid to happen. And we go, man, I really wish we would've done when we were all talking about it and thinking about it. We had Kevin Oschner, um, good friend of both of ours, speak. He is our, our opening keynote speaker at our symposium and. He said, you know, I kind of got some thoughts and ideas here, and I had no idea what he was expecting to come in. It I ga I tasked him with kind of a one unity, for the industry. You know, what, how can we make this a one unity effort instead of going around in circles? Let's push us forward in one direction and move on with life. And if he didn't say something that I thought was the most powerful, that's just resonated with me ever since then is, he said so many times we sit in the beef cattle industry and go, oh, the industry should do this. Uh, yeah, the industry, we sh as an industry, we should, we should get a, uh, traceability system in on place and onboard. he said, We are the industry, you're the industry. I'm the industry. It's gonna take individual action from to get this done. individual action within anything as part of the beef cattle industry is the industry getting a traceability system done. And I, I thought he put that so eloquently that, it takes individual action for the industry to get this done and, and we'll continue to into the future. And so I appreciate the opportunity to be on. Matt, this has been, uh, tremendous and, really enjoyed listening to your podcast and having the opportunity to talk about what we do at Cattle tracee has been, uh, a great opportunity for us.
Track 1Well, it was great to have you on and, uh, great information and well said. uh, keep up the good work. So thanks a bunch, Callahan.
callahan-grund_2_01-23-2023_110653Thanks, Matt.
MattThanks for joining us for practically ranching, brought to you by Dalebanks Angus. If you enjoyed the podcast, heck even if you didn't... help us improve by leaving a comment with your review wherever you heard us. And if you want to listen again, click subscribe and catch us next week. God bless, and we look forward to visiting again soon.
